Category: Christianity

My sister thinks Jack Hibbs is so wonderful. Hibbs can find biblical prophecy being fulfilled when the local fire department rescues a kitten. Wow. Just think what Jack can do to the Bible when Donald Trump drops bombs in Iran.

Actually, Sunday, I got to find out just that. My sister sent me an hour and 38-minute video from Hibbs about all the wonders of Israel and the USA teaming up to liquidate a few Ayatollahs.

Hibbs was so excited that he started off his church service with his Middle East Bible Prophecy update. Guess he wanted to go on record before the Rapture happened so when the rest of us were left behind, he could say, “Told ya.”

I endured about 55 minutes of his presentation, at which time he seemed to be done dazzling the audience with bullshit. In the entire time, he quoted one Scripture as proof that these events were all predicted in the Old Testament. Oh, said Scripture was not cited until 49 minutes into his song-and-dance routine. I’ll have more to say about this lonely passage in a few minutes.

The sloppiness and misrepresentation of biblical theology was staggering to behold. Talk about a guy appealing to itching ears. Any time Hibbs got close to a biblical theme, he spouted distortions, lies, and half-truths.

I will not give you a play-by-play review of his talk, but I did make a few notes as I listened. I shared these with my sister. My problem is that my sister will take Hibbs over the Bible any time a conflict or contradiction is mentioned. She thinks that she is a “good Christian” but simultaneously denies that Scripture is the final interpreter of Scripture. How can you win a biblical argument with someone that denies biblical authority?

Here are a few gems from Hibbs’ talk that caught my attention:

Hibbs talked about Iran and other nations being run by evil principalities. Sorry, Jack. These principalities were overthrown at the Cross. Jesus is ruler of all the nations and has been for about 2,000 years. Check out Michael Heiser’s Unseen Realm if you really want a deep dive on the spiritual world.

 For unto the angels hath he not put in subjection the world to come, whereof we speak.

Hebrews 2:5.

Oh, and we are rulers with Christ.

And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him.

Daniel 7:27.

Later, Hibbs talked about the Roman Empire. Jack claimed that the Roman Empire “just fell apart.” No Jack, biblically, it was struck by a rock which was Christ and His Gospel that destroyed the old pagan order and is growing into a rock that will one day fill the earth. It’s a dominant part of prophecy in Daniel.

44 And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand for ever. 45 Forasmuch as thou sawest that the stone was cut out of the mountain without hands, and that it brake in pieces the iron, the brass, the clay, the silver, and the gold; the great God hath made known to the king what shall come to pass hereafter: and the dream is certain, and the interpretation thereof sure.

Daniel 2:44–45.

35 Then was the iron, the clay, the brass, the silver, and the gold, broken to pieces together, and became like the chaff of the summer threshing floors; and the wind carried them away, that no place was found for them: and the stone that smote the image became a great mountain, and filled the whole earth.

Daniel 2:35.

Or if you prefer a New Testament analogy, the Gospel is the yeast that is leavening the whole world.

33 Another parable spake he unto them; The kingdom of heaven is like unto leaven, which a woman took, and hid in three measures of meal, till the whole was leavened.

Matthew 13:33.

20 And again he said, Whereunto shall I liken the kingdom of God? 21 It is like leaven, which a woman took and hid in three measures of meal, till the whole was leavened.

Luke 13:20–21.

After talking extensively about Esther, Hibbs gets to Jeremiah 49:34-39. Again, this is a Bible prophecy update and the only Scripture that Hibbs quoted is 49 minutes into his presentation. He claims that Jeremiah’s prophecy is a future event that we see fulfilled before our eyes in the attack on Iran. Sorry Jack but the footnote in my Bible says the passage in Jeremiah was literally fulfilled in 595 B.C. Using the prophetic scissors on biblical texts mind trick doesn’t work on me.

The footnote for Jeremiah 49:34-39 reads: “A prophecy against Elam, an important power to the east of Babylon, subjugated by Assyria, but resurgent in the Babylonian period. The prophecy possibly relates to a Babylonian containment campaign against Elam in 595 B.C.”

As I was writing this, I found a related post from Gary DeMar that takes a well-deserved whack at Hibbs.

Such a belief is pushed 24/7 on Facebook, Christian television, numerous pop-prophecy books, and articles. Jack Hibbs, Amir Tsarfati, David Jeremiah, and numerous online prophetic end-time “experts” are promoting the belief that the rapture is near, citing passages such as Jeremiah 49:34-39. Hibbs said in a recent message, “God has a plan for Elam…. There is no historian and no biblical scholar that will tell you that the prophecy of Elam was fulfilled, and it’s done and completed…. Remember the bucket you saw about the past—it doesn’t go there—but it does go in the bucket of the present.”

You might wonder what Elam has to do with Iran? Nothing. Jeremiah is not describing modern-day Persia. Elam was the son of Shem (Gen. 10:22). The Elamites are mentioned in Abraham’s time (Gen. 14), Isaiah, Jeremiah, Daniel, and Acts. Hibbs wants to turn a fulfilled prophecy into events surrounding Iran with no justification by ripping texts out of their historical context…

Like so much of what Jack Hibbs teaches on Bible prophecy, he is incorrect. Jeremiah 49:34-39 goes in the bucket of the past. “This prophecy was fulfilled by Cyrus,” Theodore Laetsch states, “the shepherd and anointed of the Lord (Is. 44:28; 45:1), who incorporated Elam as a province in his vast empire. Elamites and Medians formed part of the army of Cyrus and aided him in conquering the Babylonian Empire (Is. 21:2; Jer. 50:3, 29, archers; v. 22 bow).” There is also a New Testament counterpart where the redemption of Elam is accounted for, as Laetsch and other commentators point out. “In the New Testament era, Elam also will participate in the spiritual deliverance and salvation of God’s kingdom of Grace (cp. 2:9), for Jehovah is the God not only of judgment, but of salvation for Jews and Gentiles.”

Can We Stop All the Armageddon Talk?

Then, like a good dispensational/premillennialist, Hibbs plays the futurism card and starts talking about Jesus sitting on a literal throne in literal Jerusalem. Hey Jack, biblical Jerusalem was destroyed in 70 A.D. The Apostle Paul says our citizenship is heaven, we belong to the heavenly Jerusalem, the Jerusalem above is free, the one below is the slave, the fraud, the apostate, the shadow. Jesus is sitting on the throne now in the true Jerusalem, he has no need of a literal chair in a literal Jerusalem to fulfill His purposes.

22 For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman. 23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; wbut he of the freewoman was by promise. 24 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar. 25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children. 26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.

Galatians 4:22–26.

But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, 23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

Hebrews 12:22–23.

I just get tired of every new generation of advocates for dispensational/premillennialist thinking they will get it right when all others before them have failed. If only we stoned false prophets like they did in the Old Testament … They are just as stuck on stupid as Liberals thinking, when we get our chance to try socialism, it will finally work. Both are equally tilting at windmills of their own creation.

No matter how much prophecy pimps like Jack Hibbs can itch your ears and dazzle you, you are still being led away from the Truth. Repent means turning around. Try it sometime.

Yep, it came up at the Bible study last night that I don’t believe in Scofield’s theological system. People were shocked. We keep reading in the Minor Prophets about the “Day of the Lord” and I asserted that in most cases the day of the Lord is history not a near coming, future event.

The study leader rightly asked me about 1 Thessalonians 4: 13-18. I know this is a difficult passage to discuss so I told him that I would have an answer for him next week. He agreed. Below is my attempt to address his question.

13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. 15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. 16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. 18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.1 Thessalonians 4:13–18.

As pointed out during my research, the better question is not what is my understanding of I Thessalonians 4, but what is the Bible’s understanding? My frustration is that people cannot deal correctly with the Scriptures when they already have their minds made up as to what it means. You cannot find the Darby/Scofield/Dispensational/Premillennial view in Scripture unless you assume it ahead of time and then cherry pick passages to support it; part of this is by excluding or dismissing passages that conflict with these assumptions.

Three Often Cited Proofs of Rapture

While I Thessalonians 4 is used as a proof text of the Rapture doctrine, it is often coupled with a portion of Matthew 24 and an observation about Revelation. You can think of these as the three legs of the stool supporting the Rapture.

I will comment briefly on Matthew and Revelation and then return to I Thessalonians.

Usually, followers of Scofield couple the belief in the Rapture with this passage in Matthew 24: 37-42.

 37 But as the days of Noe [Noah] were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, 39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

Matthew 24:37–42.

In Noah’s day, the righteous were preserved in the ark while the evil men were literally washed away. During the Exodus, the evil men died in the wilderness and the righteous entered the promised land. The New Testament repeatedly promises the world to the righteous and not after the end of all things. The meek will inherit the earth not the wicked. This is a consistent theme in Psalms. Thus, the Matthew passage really says that the evil folks will be done away with (raptured if you will) and the faithful will remain on the earth.

Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.

Matthew 5:5.

But the meek shall inherit the earth; And shall delight themselves in the abundance of peace.

Psalm 37:11.

It is ours to enjoy now not in the afterlife. We rule and reign with Christ, now not after death.

For evildoers shall be cut off: But those that wait upon the LORD, they shall inherit the earth. For yet a little while, and the wicked shall not be: Yea, thou shalt diligently consider his place, and it shall not be.

Psalm 37:9-10.

Wait on the LORD, and keep his way, And he shall exalt thee to inherit the land: When the wicked are cut off, thou shalt see it. 

Psalm 37:34.

Now ye are full, now ye are rich, ye have reigned as kings without us: and I would to God ye did reign, that we also might reign with you.

1 Corinthians 4:8–6:2.

We, as believers, will judge the world and even angels.

2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters? 3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?

1 Corinthians 6:2–3.

If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us:

2 Timothy 2:12.

26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations: 27 And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father. 28 And I will give him the morning star.

Revelation 2:26–3:21.

And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

Revelation 5:10.

These are now promises, not something for the afterlife. Believers rule the world with Christ now.

Just because Christians do not believe the Bible does not make it’s promises untrue. Unbelief is a denial of God’s promises. Sadly, too many followers of Christ think our world belongs to Satan, a defeated foe by the power of the Cross. Jesus is ruling and reigning now. How people miss the importance of the Ascension of Christ is truly remarkable. How they can think Jesus is on the throne now but not ruling is horrifying. Why else were we commanded to pray that, “Try will be done on earth as it is in Heaven.”

The third leg of the Rapture stool is literally an argument from silence; namely, the church is never mentioned in the book of Revelation after chapter 3. John only mentions local congregations in chapters 2 and 3 and makes zero references to the Universal Church anywhere in Revelation. The word “church” never appears again in Revelation but clearly the church is mentioned throughout the book by other names.  To claim that the Church no longer exists or is annihilated after chapter 3 is nonsense. Arguing a doctrinal proof on the basis of a word not being in the text is stupid. Here are a few other examples of this fallacy.

Love is never mentioned in the book of Ruth.

God is never mentioned in the book of Esther.

Sex in never mentioned in the Song of Solomon.

Church is not mentioned in the first 15 chapters of Romans.

Thus, whether the word “church” (ecclesia meaning assembly) is mentioned throughout Revelation, the book is clearly about Christ and His Bride the Church.

Appeals to Matthew 24 commenting “.. as in the days of Noah …” or missing the word “church” after a certain point in in Revelation, do nothing to strengthen claims that the Bible teaches the Rapture doctrine. Can we let Scripture interpret Scripture and using only the Bible find a better explanation as to what is happening in I Thessalonians 4?

 What is Not Found in I Thessalonians 4

I found two great quotes on the topic that I wish to cite here.

In a debate on eschatology with Dave Hunt, I challenged him to point to one verse that taught a pre-tribulation rapture. He immediately appealed to I Thessalonians 4:16-17. Read it for yourself. The idea of a pre-tribulation rapture must be assumed by the reader and imposed on the text. Sound biblical interpretation, however, requires textual proof before a doctrine can be formulated.

Most postmillennialists and amillennialists teach that I Thessalonians 4:16-17 relates to the general resurrection of the saints. The text simply describes the raising of those who are “in Christ.” No mention is made of the church being raptured either before, during, or after a tribulation period. Nothing in the text points to a tribulation period.  

[Last Days Madness, Gary Demar (2024), page 223.]

Even pre-tribulation dispensationalists admit the novelty of this position [the rapture]:

It is scarcely to be found in a single book or sermon through the period of 1600 years! If any doubt this statement, let them search … the remarks of the so-called Fathers, both pre and post Nicene, the theological treatises of the scholastic divines, Roman Catholic writers of all shades of thought, the literature of the Reformation, the sermons and expositions of the Puritans and the general theological works of the day. He will find the “mystery” conspicuous by its absence.

[Harry A. Ironside, The Mysteries of God (1908), p 50.]

Here is a dispensationalist admitting that there is “scarcely” any historical evidence to support the position. He’s too generous. There is no evidence. So where does a dispensationalist get this doctrine? Thomas Ice, a fervent proponent of dispensationalism, writes that the theory is based on “deduction”:

A certain theological climate needed to be created before premillennialism would restore the Biblical doctrine of the pretrib Rapture. Sufficient development did not take place until after the French Revolution. The factor of the Rapture has been clearly known by the church all along; therefore, the issue is the timing of the event. Since neither pre nor posttribs have a proof text for the time of the Rapture (unless the promise made to the church in Rev. 3:10 is an exception which promises deliverance—the Rapture—from the future tribulation before the seven-year period begins), then it is clear that this issue is the product of a deduction from one’s overall system of theology, both for pre and posttribbers.

[Thomas D Ice,The Origin of the Pretrib Rapture Part II (1989), p5.]

What an admission! A pillar doctrine of dispensationalism does not have a single text to prove it. Dispensationalism’s process of “deducing” the rapture theory is this: First, create the system; second, create the doctrines to make the system work; third, claim to have restored “the Biblical doctrines of the pretrib Rapture,” which is based on a “deduction from one’s overall system of theology” because there are no verses that teach it; fourth, imply that the early church, the “apostles of the apostles,” knew nothing of this foundational doctrine. Bizarre. Millions of Christians today hold to a system of interpretation (dispensationalism) that does not have one verse to prove one of its foundational doctrines, the pre-tribulation rapture of the church, the concept that makes dispensationalism dispensational. This system of interpretation is a theological house of cards.

[Last Days Madness, Gary Demar (2024), page 224-225.]

Folks, Ironside and Ice are heavy hitters in the dispensationalist camp, The admissions that they make are not to be lightly dismissed.

If you don’t know Thomas ice, here is some relevant info from Wikipedia.

Ice is a proponent of dispensational premillennialism. He was the executive director of the Pre-Trib Research Center on the campus of Liberty University in Lynchburg, Virginia. The research center was founded in 1994 by Tim LaHaye and Ice to research, teach, proclaim, and defend pre-tribulationism. The center currently sponsors prophecy meetings and conferences and provides speakers for the purpose of discussion and lecture on the topic of pre-tribulationism.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Ice

If you don’t know Harry A ironside, here is some relevant info from Wikipedia.

 (October 14, 1876 – January 15, 1951) was a Canadian–American Bible teacher, preacher, theologian, pastor and author who pastored Moody Church in Chicago from 1929 to 1948.

Ironside believed that the church is parenthetical, which was something not revealed in the Old Testament, and at some point God will rapture the church before the great tribulation, during which he will again focus on the nation of Israel.

Along with others such as Cyrus Scofield, he was influential in popularizing dispensationalism among Protestants in North America. Despite his lack of formal education, his mental capacity, photographic memory and zeal for his beliefs caused him to be called “the Archbishop of Fundamentalism”.

Ironside was one of the most prolific Christian writers of the 20th century and published more than 100 books, booklets and pamphlets, a number of which are still in print. One editorial reviewer wrote of a 2005 re-publication, “Ironside’s commentaries are a standard and have stood the test of time.”

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harry_A._Ironside

So what did Scofield claim about I Thessalonian 4?

Scofield, asserts in his only footnote on I Thessalonians 4:

(4:17) This central passage on the blessed hope of the Church includes: (1) reassurance (vv. 13-14); (2) revelation (vv. 15-17, setting forth the return of Christ, the rapture of the Church, and the reunion of all believers); and (3) comfort (v. 18).

Scofield is very silent on a doctrine that is a cornerstone of his theological system. Weird. The chief proof text of the Rapture is given one footnote of one sentence in his Bible. No mention of judgment, great tribulation, antichrist, or any of the other things often talked about in the wake of the Rapture. Scofield just assumes it. Thomas Ice deduces it.

If not The Rapture, Then …

If I Thessalonians 4 is not the Rapture of popular understanding, then what is happening in this text?

Not much if the Westminster Confession of Faith is any metric.

Chapter XXXII

Of the State of Men after Death, and of the Resurrection of the Dead

Article II

At the last day, such as are found alive shall not die, but be changed: and all the dead shall be raised up, with the selfsame bodies, and none other (although with different qualities), which shall be united again to their souls forever.

This Confession, which I suspect is like many others from the Reformation era, simply cites I Thessalonians 4:17 as a proof text for resurrection on the last day. This article of the Confession parrots part of the Nicene Creed.

We look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the world to come.

This more traditional view is echoed by David Chilton in Days of Vengeance.

There is thus to be a resurrection at the end of history, at the Second Coming of Christ on the Last Day (John 6:38-40, 44, 54; Acts 24:15; 1 Thess. 4:14-17). But before that final resurrection there is another, a First Resurrection: the resurrection of “Christ the first fruits.” He rose from the dead, and resurrected all believers with Him. Note: St. John does not say that the believer himself as such is resurrected, but that he has a part in the First Resurrection. He is sharing in the Resurrection of Another-the Resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ.

[David Chilton, Days of Vengeance (1987), p. 517.]

The Hope of Israel and the Nations

It seems that many non-dispensational folks don’t expend a lot of theological energy on I Thessalonians since all it says is Jesus will come back some day, raise sleeping saints, and then the living will join him. Often it is assumed that this will happen at the end of all things but there is another possibility.

I found a transcript of a different and more nuanced point of view on this passage. The paper is linked here and cost $2.95. The paper makes a biblically defensible argument for a third possible understanding of the Thessalonian passage. Participants are Gary DeMar as interviewer and Kim Burgess as guest.

Burgess’ point of view is that the Old Covenant is types and shadows; materials representations of spiritual reality, while the New Covenant is the spiritual reality. Burgess cites examples of the New Covenant being spiritual as John 4, the woman at the well “you will never thirst”; John 3, “ye must be born again”; and John 6, “labor for meat that endureth to everlasting life.” The spiritual reality of the New Covenant is illustrated in Paul’s letter to the Galatians.

22 For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman. 23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise. 24 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar. 25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children. 26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all. 27 For it is written, Rejoice, thou barren that bearest not; break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for the desolate hath many more children than she which hath an husband. 28 Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise. 29 But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now. 30 Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman. 31 So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free. Galatians 4:22–31.

In the paper, they argue for the nearness of the coming of the Lord in judgment. Part of that coming involves the Old Covenant saints being released from Sheol and being brought into heaven. (The subject of 1 Corinthians 15.) Further that the meeting with the Lord in the air or in heavenly places is a transfer in status from the Old to the New Covenant order.

Kim: In the transition to the New Covenant order we see that a switch has taken place from the physical or material hermeneutic (e.g., the physical and visible temple or mountain) to the “Spiritual” or “heavenly” hermeneutic (cf. the heavenly Jerusalem and Zion of Hebrews 12:22). Paul uses these two modifying terms quite deliberately in 1 Corinthians 15:44-49. In 1 Thessalonians 4:16 we still have the language of “the Lord coming down” in Exodus 19:20 (see also “the glory of the Lord” resting on Mt. Sinai in Ex. 24:16-17), but the text does not actually say He came down to Earth in the flesh or that He was to appear there physically/bodily. That is an assumption that we read into the text while hardly being aware that we are doing it. He was to “come down or descend” and the saints—the dead and the living—were to go to “a meeting” with Him “in the air.” We will come back soon to the meaning of “in the clouds” and “in the air.” The point for now is that this is the Spiritual and heavenly reality (the antitype) of what was formerly, in the Old Testament, a physical type.

Kim: It is the all-too-common physical (bodily) rapture mentality of Dispensationalism that tends to get hold of us if we are not careful and re-wires our brains to think that Paul is describing people being moved bodily from point A to point B geographically, in this case from earth to heaven, but it is just not so here in 4:17. It is a spiritual transition from death to Life (i.e., eternal Life in Christ) that is in view.

Kim: Let’s get back to verse 17. The English translation I am using (NASB) reads “to meet the Lord in the air,” but, in the Greek, it is actually a noun and not a verb: “to a meeting of the Lord in the air.” That noun is ἀπάντησις (apantēsis) and refers to “a meeting.” Do you know where else this same noun is used? It’s in Matthew 25:1 and 6 about the five foolish and five wise virgins going out to “a meeting of the bridegroom.” This is the same “meeting” as in 4:17. It is a wedding theme. See Revelation 19:5-9 for more detail. This “meeting,” I believe, is what John calls “the marriage supper of the Lamb.”

Gary: Mike Sullivan brings out the wedding parallels found in Matthew 24-25 and 1 Thessalonians 4-5 in the section below from his extended chart on the topic.

Paul’s use of the trumpet and the cloud in I Thessalonians 4:16 is a direct reference to the Glory Cloud in Exodus and also the arrival of the Holy Spirt on Pentecost (Acts 2). David Chilton, quoted earlier, called the Glory Cloud “God’s mobile home” and cites Merideth Kline’s Images in the Spirit which documents the Cloud’s appearance in Scripture from Genesis to Revelation.

As added support to the claim that 1 Thessalonians 4 is about an event in the First Century, look also at II Thessalonians Chapter 1.

6 Seeing it is a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you; 7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, 8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: 9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; 10 When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day. 11 Wherefore also we pray always for you, that our God would count you worthy of this calling, and fulfil all the good pleasure of his goodness, and the work of faith with power: 12 That the name of our Lord Jesus Christ may be glorified in you, and ye in him, according to the grace of our God and the Lord Jesus Christ.

2 Thessalonians 1:6–12.

Paul promises the Thessalonians that they, in the First Century, will get relief from persecution. Using language typical of biblical prophets, Paul promises that Jesus will use flaming fire to take vengeance on the godless who will be punished with everlasting destruction and simultaneously, the saints will be glorified. So, did the Thessalonians get relief as Paul promised, or did he lie?

Another passage also says Jesus will deliver Paul’s Thessalonian readers from the wrath to come.

10 And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come.

1 Thessalonians 1:10.

The Thessalonians were promised deliverance from the “wrath to come.” It was a near event, not one two thousand years away. These promises of relief are very similar to those given to the seven churches in Revelation chapters 2 and 3.

Conclusion

Using only Scripture as your guide, there is zero biblical warrant for the Rapture doctrine. Only by bringing a pre-existing system to the pages of Scripture can you assume a Rapture doctrine exists somewhere in the Bible. Thomas Ice admits that the Rapture is “deduced” and not actually found in the Bible. If you say something loud enough and often enough people tend to believe it. Its just as true in theology as it is in politics or the media.

The trumpet in 1 Thessalonians 4:16, as shown by Mike Sullivan’s chart, is the same as the trumpet in Matthew 24:31. Kim Burgess elsewhere states that the trumpet in 1 Corinthians 15:52 and Revelation’s 7^th trumpet are the same event as well. Four passages, same trumpet, same event. Whether past or future, I think Burgess is correct about all four verses are the same event.

I think there is a good argument, that during the coming of Jesus in the judgment of 70 AD, that 1 Thessalonians 4: 13-17 was fulfilled. Others believe the passage in 1 Thessalonians 4 occurs at the end of time. Either way, there is no need for a Rapture as understood in the Premillennial/Dispensational system. When the central event of a theological system must be assumed because there are no proof texts for it, then it is time to reevaluate the position.

As for my opinion on the text, I’m inclined to go with DeMar and Burgess. Jesus judged Jerusalem in 70 AD but continues that rule and judgment today. It is an ongoing process that will culminate in a final resolution in the future.     

For the earth shall be filled with the knowledge of the glory of the LORD, As the waters cover the sea.

Habakkuk 2:14.

I know that Dispensationalists frequently miss the mark on biblical theology. They like to beat the strawman of “Replacement Theology” when they are the only ones that teach a form of it. They switch out the Old Testament Jews with the Church in the mythical (mythical because it doesn’t really exist) Eschatological Parenthesis of the Church Age.

In their system, God quits dealing with the Jews once they reject the offer of the Kingdom of God that Jesus and John the Baptist offered in the First Century. God, frustrated by the liberal use of freewill to reject His plan, then pivots to Plan B, the Church Age. At the end of time, God will Rapture all the Christians off the planet which terminates Plan B. God then returns to His original plan. Then He promptly kills off 2/3 of the Jews. Then the pride of the remaining Jews will be broken and then they will all convert to belief in Jesus. Once, the Jews are sufficiently calibrated, Jesus will return to rule for 1,000 years sitting on a literal throne in Jerusalem.

Folks, this is way better than Ray Bradberry or Phillip K. Dick could ever imagine. Tens of millions of Evangelical protestants believe everything I just said and then some. They think all the above can be found in the pages of the Bible. It can’t unless you use lots of glue, scissors, paste, and imagination. Oh, and discard most of the Bible in the process. No worries though. They are hell bent of defending this escapist trash as the Gospel.

Thankfully, you don’t have to be stuck in denial of the ramifications of the Great Commission.

Today’s lesson is from the book of Matthew.  It teaches that Jesus is the true Israel. This being true, then His followers are part of the true Israel too. This is yet another way of showing that God took a remnant from Old Covenant Israel and grafted in the Gentiles. This New Testament Body of Christ is the true Israel. This is yet another rebuttal to the charge of Replacement Theology that Dispensationalists try to level against their opponents. I talked about the Body of Christ being a continuation of the OT believers and its expansion to include Gentiles in my previous post. This post will be about Matthew and his teaching that Jesus is the true Israel.

And when they were departed, behold, the angel of the Lord appeareth to Joseph in a dream, saying, Arise, and take the young child and his mother, and flee into Egypt, and be thou there until I bring thee word: for Herod will seek the young child to destroy him. When he arose, he took the young child and his mother by night, and departed into Egypt: And was there until the death of Herod: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying, Out of Egypt have I called my son. 

Matthew 2:13–15.

Here is the Old Testament reference.

When Israel was a child, then I loved him, And called my son out of Egypt.

Hosea 11:1.

OK, you need to ask yourself if Matthew was just being cute by emphasizing the “out of Egypt I called my son” or if he made a mistake in an effort to come up with a fulfilled prophecy concerning Jesus, or did he really mean that Jesus is the true Israel?

Well, yep, Jesus is the true Israel was his point. That is why he includes the account of the temptation in the wilderness. Jesus wandered about in the desert for forty days, the children of Israel wandered about for forty years. Jesus passed his time of testing, but Israel failed and wandered 40 years as a result.

So, Jesus was the true Israel, and his followers are the true Israel.

Here is how Logos Bible Software summarizes the idea that Jesus is the True Israel.

Search criteria > Jesus is the true Israel

Jesus embodies the role Israel failed to fulfill—he succeeds where the nation disobeyed, demonstrating faithful obedience where they rebelled.[1][2] This identity emerges through Matthew’s deliberate recapitulation of Israel’s foundational narrative. Matthew applies Hosea 11:1 (“Out of Egypt I called my son”) to Jesus and structures his Gospel to mirror Israel’s exodus from Egypt, crossing of the Red Sea, wilderness temptations, and arrival at Mount Sinai to receive the law.[1]

The theological significance runs deeper than mere historical parallels. As God’s Son, Jesus reflects his Father’s character and ways, proving himself the true Israelite through obedience to the law where Israel disobeyed and submission to God’s will where they rebelled.[1] Where Israel failed the desert temptations, Jesus remained faithful to God.[3] Jesus is not simply Israel’s savior; he embodies what Israel was meant to be.[1]

This fulfillment extends to Israel’s covenantal purpose. As the true Israelite, Jesus stands on God’s side, championing his cause and embodying his character, becoming the true covenant partner through his fully human trust and obedience.[1] He fulfills this role not for himself but for the faithless covenant partner—achieving righteousness and obedience on behalf of God’s people through his representative work.[1] Paul develops this concept by presenting Jesus as Abraham’s seed who truly inherits the covenant promises, stepping into the position of those under the law to redeem them and realize the blessings in himself.[3]

[1] Michael D. Williams, Far as the Curse Is Found: The Covenant Story of Redemption (Phillipsburg, NJ: P&R Publishing, 2005), 225.

[2] Barry E. Horner, Biblical Israel: The Anti-Judaic Incursion of Process Biblical Theology (Barry E. Horner, 2021), 91.

[3] S. Motyer, “Israel (Nation),” in New Dictionary of Biblical Theology, ed. T. Desmond Alexander and Brian S. Rosner (Downers Grove, IL: InterVarsity Press, 2000), 585.

If you are interested, I got this blog idea from Doug Wilson and then looked it up on Logos as a second witness.

Folks, a bedrock belief of the Scofield Reference Bible is Zionism. Scofield taught that Jesus offered the Kingdom of God to the Jews. The First Century Jews rejected it, and God went to Plan B, the Church. Sometime in the future, God will remove the Church (via a secret rapture) and then get back to dealing with the Jews. This is actual Replacement Theology. Scofield’s followers claim they oppose Replacement Theology but theirs is a strawman argument used to silence those that disagree with their extrabiblical views. Scofield is the one that replaces Israel with the Church. The Bible clearly teaches that the Church is the true Israel created from a remnant of Israel that later had Gentiles grafted into it.

For if the casting away of them be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be, but life from the dead? For if the firstfruit be holy, the lump is also holy: and if the root be holy, so are the branches. And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree; Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee. Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be graffed in. Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.

Romans 11:15–21.

Included with Scofield’s view is a rebuilt Temple in Jerusalem, renewal of sacrifices in said temple, a worldwide tribulation, a worldwide political dictator commonly known as The Antichrist, lots of dead Jews, and if Hal Lidsey and others are to be believed, a thermonuclear war ending with Jesus sitting on an earthly throne in Jerusalem. Part of Scofield’s system is that God is not done with the Jews and has not kept His Word to them to fulfill the promises made to Abraham. (I mostly rebuked this in my last post.)

Bless Those That Bless You

I would like to look again at Genesis chapter 12. Specifically, what Scofield does with the initial promise to Abram.

“I will make you into a great nation, and I will bless you; I will make your name great, and you will be a blessing. I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you I will curse; and all peoples on earth will be blessed through you.”

Genesis 12:2-3. NIV

The following is from Scofield’s footnotes on this verse. I am starting at point 3 since it is the thing you hear most often parroted by his vast array of followers.

(3) Promises to Gentiles. (a) “I will bless those who bless you” (Gen. 12:3). Those who honor Abraham will be blessed. (b) “And whoever curses you I will curse” (Gen. 12:3). This was a warning literally fulfilled in the history of Israel’s persecutions. It has invariably fared ill with the people who have persecuted the Jew—well with those who have protected him. For a nation to commit the sin of anti-Semitism brings inevitable judgment. The future will still more remarkably prove this principle.

Scofield then lists a set of verses that he claims support his claim. Five of the seven passages are directly related to the restoration of Israel after the Babylonian Captivity and are thus one-time events which were already fulfilled. The only other Old Testament verse is Deuteronomy 30: 7 KJV

“And the LORD thy God will put all these curses upon thine enemies, and on them that hate thee, which persecuted thee.”

In context the verse is saying that God will use Gentile nations to judge (punish) Israel for violating the Covenant (see Deuteronomy 28: 15-68) and then God will judge the nations that he used to punish Israel.

The outlier to these verses is his reference to Matthew 25:40, 45 which have nothing to do with Abraham or Israel. Sorry but these references in Matthew are completely unrelated to the topic.

And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me

Matthew 25:40 KJV.

Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.

Matthew 25:45 KJV.

The bottom line of his footnote is that Genesis 12:2-3 has nothing to do with Israel since Israel (Jacob) was not a glimmer in anybody’s eye yet. In fact, at this point in the story, Abraham was still Abram and had yet to enter into a Covenant with God. Scofield has done sleight of hand and gotten away with it.

His supporting verses are just crap. He is blowing enough smoke that he hopes his claim will be convincing. I find it curious that he doesn’t quote the obvious story of Balaam being hired to curse Israel if this passage truly means what he claims.

The other passage that gets quoted often to bolster Zionism is this one.

The Peace of Jerusalem

“Pray for the peace of Jerusalem: They shall prosper that love thee.”

Psalm 122:6.

Thus, if you support Jerusalem and by extension, Israel, God must bless you. On the other hand, if you oppose Jerusalem then God will punish you. This is taken literally by Scofield led Zionists to be true today even though the biblical nation of Israel was wiped off the map 2,000 years ago and the Old Testament worship ceased forever at that point. The current nation, established in 1948, is not based on the Bible or the law of Moses, instead it is a secular State, but is viewed by many as biblically relevant anyway. Modern Israel’s mere existence is cited as irrefutable proof that Jesus will return any minute.

At one time, Iraqi leader, Sadam Husain, had wanted to restore the city of Babylon. If he had changed the name of the country to Babylon, would all the old biblical passages be recycled again to somehow be relevant in the 21^st Century just because of a name change?

The other question that should occur in your mind is why does a literal city in Jerusalem matter at all once you have read the New Testament? The Old Covenant is physical and tangible while the New Covenant is Spiritual.

Somehow Scofield and his minions skip the necessary verses because they don’t fit their presuppositions. The fact is that their best exegetical tool is a pair of household scissors. That way they can cut out the verse they want while simultaneously discarding the limitations of the context and then can make an isolated passage mean whatever they want.

Let’s add a few New Testament passages to the mix.

For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman. But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise. Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar. For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children. But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all. For it is written, Rejoice, thou barren that bearest not; break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for the desolate hath many more children than she which hath an husband. Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise. But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.  Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman. So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free.

Galatians 4:22–31.

So, we, as Christians, belong to the Jerusalem that is above, not the earthly one which is a city of slaves since it is filled with the offspring of Hagar (Agar).

 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

Hebrews 12:22–23.

In biblical theology, there is the type/antitype model. The type is often an earthly shadow of a heavenly reality. The heavenly reality is the antitype. Likewise, the physical, earthly Jerusalem is a foreshadowing of the heavenly City, the real Jerusalem.

 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

Revelation 21:2.

And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,

Revelation 21:10.

If you follow this type/antitype theme, you will find that the New Testament Zion and Jerusalem are spiritual realities that were foreshadowed by earthly, Old Testament counterparts. So, when you pray for the peace of Jerusalem in our time, it is really a prayer for God to bless His Church not that he blesses a piece of dirt in Palestine. The piece of dirt in Palestine is just dirt, not something with any spiritual significance. Old Covenant Israel is dead and buried and has been since 70 A.D. whether Scofield or Ted Cruz or Mike Huckabee say differently.

Conclusion

There is nothing special about the Jews in God’s plan, they come to God on the same basis as everyone else; namely, faith in Jesus Christ or not at all. The current and very secular nation of Israel has zero to do with biblical prophecy. All promises in the Old Testament that were made to national Israel were fulfilled long ago. It is a myth that any promises to Old Covenant Israel remain unfulfilled.

Scofield frequently ignores history to force already fulfilled prophecy into the future. Like, many before him, he ignores the time markers given in Scripture because they don’t fit with his presuppositions. I will look more at these areas in upcoming installments.

I was going to write a single blog post of the topic of Zionism and America, but the task is just too darn long, so I am opting to break it into smaller pieces. Each part will stand on its own. I don’t know how consistent that I will be working on this, but right now I feel like getting it started.

My purpose in writing this is to prove that most of what Evangelical Christians claim as future prophecy was fulfilled long ago and thus their worldview is hopelessly broken. Perhaps a few will be honest enough to look at the source material and believe it once their presuppositions have been shown to be faulty.

First up is the issue of God’s promises to Abraham. Lest you think this is just a theoretical exercise, check out this article.

[Mike] Huckabee also defended the historical and theological claim that present day Israel is the Israel of the Bible, as have GOP U.S. Senators Ted Cruz of Texas and Lindsey Graham of South Carolina. Huckabee said the Bible would justify Israel’s seizing territory in the Middle East from the Euphrates River in Iraq to the Nile in Egypt.

Huckabee Defends Pollard Meeting, Says God Promised Israel the Entire Middle East

As he did during his testy exchange with Cruz, Carlson pressed Huckabee on the meaning of Genesis 15:18: “To thy seed will I give this land, from the river of Egypt even to the great river Euphrates.”

That would include the “entire Middle East,” including Syria, Lebanon, Jordan, and Saudi Arabia, Carlson said. In other words, whole countries.

“It would be a big piece of land,” Huckabee agreed:

“But here’s the point. … This particular area that we’re talking about now, Israel, is a land that God gave through Abraham to a people that he chose. It was a people, a place, and a purpose. We can look at it that way.”

Carlson insisted that Huckabee explain what “land” he meant. “Does Israel have the right to that land? Because you’re appealing to Genesis, you’re saying that’s the original deed?” Carlson asked.

Huckabee: “It would be fine if they took it all.”

• What are the promises that God made to Abram?
• Were these promises fulfilled?
• Is the modern nation of Israel biblically relevant?

God’s first promise to Abram is when Abram was called by the Lord.

Now the LORD had said unto Abram, Get thee out of thy country, and from thy kindred, and from thy father’s house, unto a land that I will shew thee: And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing: And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.

Genesis 12:1–3.

I plan to have more to say on portions of this passage in a later post. In Genesis 15, God makes a covenant with Abram. Later God changes his name to Abraham.

Here is the first promise, Abram’s seed (descendants) will be as numerous as the stars.

And, behold, the word of the LORD came unto him, saying, This shall not be thine heir; but he that shall come forth out of thine own bowels shall be thine heir. And he brought him forth abroad, and said, Look now toward heaven, and tell the stars, if thou be able to number them: and he said unto him, So shall thy seed be. And he believed in the LORD; and he counted it to him for righteousness.

Genesis 15:4–6.

The next promise that God gave Abram was a land grant. The caveat was that the land could not be inherited for four hundred years. This is a prophecy of the captivity in Egypt.

And he said unto Abram, Know of a surety that thy seed shall be a stranger in a land that is not theirs, and shall serve them; and they shall afflict them four hundred years; And also that nation, whom they shall serve, will I judge: and afterward shall they come out with great substance. And thou shalt go to thy fathers in peace; thou shalt be buried in a good old age. 16 But in the fourth generation they shall come hither again: for the iniquity of the Amorites is not yet full.

Genesis 15:13–16.

Later, the land grant is given more specifically.

In the same day the LORD made a covenant with Abram, saying, Unto thy seed have I given this land, from the river of Egypt unto the great river, the river Euphrates:

Genesis 15:18.

So, God in Genesis chapters 12 to 15 made Abraham three promises, That he would have many offspring, that the nations of the earth would be blessed, and that a parcel of land would be given.

When God late announces that Abram will be the father of Isaac, he changes his name to Abraham and his wife then becomes Sarah.

As for me, behold, my covenant is with thee, and thou shalt be a father of many nations. Neither shall thy name any more be called Abram, but thy name shall be Abraham; for a father of many nations have I made thee. And I will make thee exceeding fruitful, and I will make nations of thee, and kings shall come out of thee. And I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be a God unto thee, and to thy seed after thee. And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.

Genesis 17:4–8.

Nations Blessed

Per the New Testament, the ultimate fulfillment of the world being blessed by the seed of Abraham was found in Jesus Christ.

Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ. Galatians 3:16.

Land Promise

Later, the land promise is affirmed to Josua.

Every place that the sole of your foot shall tread upon, that have I given unto you, as I said unto Moses. From the wilderness and this Lebanon even unto the great river, the river Euphrates, all the land of the Hittites, and unto the great sea toward the going down of the sun, shall be your coast.

Joshua 1:3–4.

Joshua, at the end of his life gives a different description of the Promised Land.

And ye have seen all that the LORD your God hath done unto all these nations because of you; for the LORD your God is he that hath fought for you. Behold, I have divided unto you by lot these nations that remain, to be an inheritance for your tribes, from Jordan, with all the nations that I have cut off, even unto the great sea westward. And the LORD your God, he shall expel them from before you, and drive them from out of your sight; and ye shall possess their land, as the LORD your God hath promised unto you.

Joshua 23:3–5.

When Joshua died, Israel controlled both sides of the Jordan River to the Mediterranean Sea. That seems a far cry from the Euphrates.

Now therefore fear the LORD, and serve him in sincerity and in truth: and put away the gods which your fathers served on the other side of the flood, and in Egypt; and serve ye the LORD.

Joshua 24:14.

However, what is the “other side of the flood”? Oh, wow! It’s the Euphrates River. So the promise was fulfilled just as God had promises Abraham.

But wait, there’s more.

David smote also Hadadezer, the son of Rehob, king of Zobah, as he went to recover his border at the river Euphrates.

2 Samuel 8:3.

King David recovered his border at the Euphrates River.

 For he [Solomon] had dominion over all the region on this side the river, from Tiphsah even to Azzah, over all the kings on this side the river: and he had peace on all sides round about him.

1 Kings 4:24.

Solomon ruled it too. So, Israel conquered the land to the Euphrates and held it for many years.

And the LORD gave unto Israel all the land which he sware to give unto their fathers; and they possessed it, and dwelt therein. And the LORD gave them rest round about, according to all that he sware unto their fathers: and there stood not a man of all their enemies before them; the LORD delivered all their enemies into their hand. There failed not ought of any good thing which the LORD had spoken unto the house of Israel; all came to pass.

Joshua 21:43–45.

Offspring as the Stars

Their children also multipliedst thou as the stars of heaven, and broughtest them into the land, concerning which thou hadst promised to their fathers, that they should go in to possess it.

Nehemiah 9:23.

Thy fathers went down into Egypt with threescore and ten persons; and now the LORD thy God hath made thee as the stars of heaven for multitude.

Deuteronomy 10:22.

Conclusion

God fulfilled all the promises made to Abraham.

Blessed be the LORD, that hath given rest unto his people Israel, according to all that he promised: there hath not failed one word of all his good promise, which he promised by the hand of Moses his servant.

1 Kings 8:56.

The Old Covenant is over and decisively so in 70 A.D; God divorced Israel, the Great Harlot, Babylon where Christ was crucified. Beginning at Pentecost, God took a new people from Israel, starting with a remnant. Later Gentiles were grafted into the cultivated olive tree (Israel). A new assembly (ecclesia) of New Testament believers arose during the last days of Israel. This is the new bride of Christ, the Church. Thus, the Church is the true Israel, the offspring of Abraham and Jacob.

Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

Romans 9:6–8.

 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham. And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed. So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham.

Galatians 3:7–9.

And if ye be Christ’s, then are ye Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Galatians 3:29.

Maintaining the land promised to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob was contingent of obedience of God’s Covenant. Moses and Joshua both knew that eventually Israel would disobey and be taken to foreign lands as punishment. A remnant would eventually return, and they were. In the final days, Israel chose Caesar over Christ. “We have no king but Caesar” and then “His blood be upon us and our children.” Jesus told them that their house would be left to them desolate and not one stone would be left upon another but by then their fate was sealed.

Huckabee, Cruz, Graham, and the rest of the disciples of Scofield are wrong but given a choice between their presuppositions and the actual text of the Bible, they can only see Scofield’s Notes. Their willful ignorance results in a fatal case of paralysis for the progress of the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

“A text without a context is a pretext, usually for error.”

Dr. Walter Martin

The Challenge

At the new church that I am attending, one of the folks in leadership challenged me to examine the phrases “Day of the Lord” and “Great Day of the Lord” in the Bible. Somehow, he thought that such a study would persuade me to become a Premillennial Dispensationalist.

I already know that there are multiple Days of the Lord in Scripture. Something he flatly seemed to denied. What follows is a brief examination of the topic.

Just to prove that I took this challenge seriously, I finally opted to subscribe to Logos Bible software.

Of course, I find that the research tools are only as good as the searchable material. Out of the box, it’s skewed towards one eschatological position, as I expected. I think balance must be found at my expense by buying better reference books. Something for a future time.

Diving In

In the meantime, let’s begin with this verse.

The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, Before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come.

Joel 2:31.

Whenever you see the sun going dark, the moon turning to blood, stars falling from the sky to earth and similar language you know that prophetic language and judgment are being discussed. The problem is that folks, for reasons that I don’t understand, think they need to take such language literally when it is clearly figurative. The sun, moon, stars language can be seen as figurative all the way back in Genesis.

Joseph had a dream that the sun, moon, and stars would bow down and worship him.

And he dreamed yet another dream, and told it his brethren, and said, Behold, I have dreamed a dream more; and, behold, the sun and the moon and the eleven stars made obeisance to me.

Genesis 37:9.

Jacob, his father, didn’t like what he was told and said:

What is this dream that thou hast dreamed? Shall I and thy mother and thy brethren indeed come to bow down ourselves to thee to the earth?

Genesis 37:10b.

From this point forward in the Bible, sun, moon, and stars are most often people and not planets or lights in the night sky.

If you follow the sun, moon, and stars motif, you will find that their failing is related to the destruction of nations, and not at the end of the world.

Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, Cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, To lay the land desolate: And he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it. For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: The sun shall be darkened in his going forth, And the moon shall not cause her light to shine.

Isaiah 13:9–10.

So, the Day of the Lord comes, and the sun, moon, and stars all fail. Clearly this is the end of the world, right?

Nope. Not even close.

Remember my opening quote about “a text without a context…”? Please look at verse 1 of the same chapter.

The burden of Babylon, which Isaiah the son of Amoz did see.

Isaiah 13:1.

Isaiah is prophesying the destruction of Babylon and calling it the Day of the Lord.

Then there is the destruction of Egypt.

 And when I shall put thee out, I will cover the heaven, and make the stars thereof dark; I will cover the sun with a cloud, and the moon shall not give her light. All the bright lights of heaven will I make dark over thee, and set darkness upon thy land, saith the Lord GOD.

Ezekiel 32:7–8.

So too the destruction of Israel is also talked about in cosmic terms.

And it shall come to pass in that day, saith the Lord GOD, That I will cause the sun to go down at noon, And I will darken the earth in the clear day: And I will turn your feasts into mourning,

Amos 8:9–10.

The Great Day of the Lord comes to Judah

Hold thy peace at the presence of the Lord GOD: For the day of the LORD is at hand: For the LORD hath prepared a sacrifice, He hath bid his guests.

Zephaniah 1:7

The great day of the LORD is near, It is near, and hasteth greatly, Even the voice of the day of the LORD: The mighty man shall cry there bitterly. That day is a day of wrath, A day of trouble and distress, A day of wasteness and desolation, A day of darkness and gloominess, A day of clouds and thick darkness,

Zephaniah 1:14–15.

Note that there is no difference between the Great Day of the Lord and the Day of the Lord. Both expressions are equal, as shown above.

Isaiah foretells the destruction of Judah and Israel.

For the day of the LORD of hosts shall be upon every one that is proud and lofty, And upon every one that is lifted up; and he shall be brought low:

Isaiah 2:12.

And what will God’s people do on the Day of the Lord?

And they shall go into the holes of the rocks, And into the caves of the earth, For fear of the LORD, and for the glory of his majesty, When he ariseth to shake terribly the earth. In that day a man shall cast his idols of silver, and his idols of gold, Which they made each one for himself to worship, To the moles and to the bats; To go into the clefts of the rocks, And into the tops of the ragged rocks, For fear of the LORD, and for the glory of his majesty, When he ariseth to shake terribly the earth.

Isaiah 2:19–21.

Then after this happened, they were taken away in chains to servitude in foreign lands.  Clearly the Day of the Lord is not the end of the world but God coming in judgment.

Modern people reading about the sun, moon, and stars being darkened or made into blood or falling to earth or whatever and trying to claim that these things will literally happen in the sky, are clearly ripping such expressions out of their biblical and prophetic context. Again, the sun, moon, and stars language is typically used to describe human rulers being overthrow. In some cases, it may be that the principalities behind these rulers are falling as well.

Thus, anyone literate in the Old Testament usage of such terms knows that Matthew 24 is speaking  in the prophetic language of Isaiah about the rulers of Israel falling and not the literal dissolution of the periodic table.

Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken

Matthew 24:29.

Sidebar

Why do these guys think that literal stars are going to fall on the earth and then there will still be life on the planet? Even a quick glance at that Bruce Willis movie will debunk such a claim and ‘ole Bruce was only dealing with an asteroid or meteor or comet, not a star. Stars fall to earth twice in the Book of Revelation, in two different chapters, but the world still exists. How can that be possible? Only if they aren’t literal stars.

When a pair of scissors is the only exegetical tool they have, I guess you can get away with such sloppy treatment of the text.

Back to More Verses

Compare Joel and Peter. Peter is clearly basing his comments on Joel; and not just on the Holy Spirit but on the coming judgment, and the admonition to call upon the name of the Lord. Joel and Peter are both saying that the sign of impending judgment is the giving of the Spirit.

And it shall come to pass afterward, That I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; And your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, Your old men shall dream dreams, Your young men shall see visions: And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids In those days will I pour out my spirit. And I will shew wonders in the heavens and in the earth, Blood, and fire, and pillars of smoke. The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, Before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come. And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the LORD shall be delivered: For in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, As the LORD hath said, And in the remnant whom the LORD shall call.

Joel 2:28–32.

Peter, preaching his first sermon in Acts says that the Holy Spirit will be given and then …

And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapor of smoke: The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come: 

Acts 2:19–20.

In Acts 2, Peter says the gift of the Holy Spirit, as prophesied by Joel has happened. The pouring out of the Spirit was something predicted for the last days. Clearly the last days of the Old Covenant, since the Spirit is the sign of the New Covenant. Peter says Joel was very clear on that point.

But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel; And it shall come to pass in the last days …

Acts 2:16–17a.

Peter then issued a warning that the existing political order is about to collapse. Peter calls this something that happens before the Day of the Lord. Peter exhorts his audience to believe in Jesus and concludes his sermon with a plea to save yourselves from this wicked generation.

Clearly Peter believed that the generation alive in his day was soon to face the Day of the Lord just as Jesus had previously predicted.

This is the same admonition given by John the Baptist who warned people to flee the wrath to come.

Then said he to the multitude that came forth to be baptized of him, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?

Luke 3:7.

Judgment was coming for them, and soon. By the time we get to the epistles of John, it is no longer the last days but the last hour (I John 2:18).

Other Synonyms for Day of the Lord

Days of Vengeance

The passage in Luke that is parallel to Matthew 23 – 25 includes the following:

And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto. For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled

Luke 21:20–22.

Please note in the passage above, fleeing the destruction of Jerusalem is accomplished by fleeing to the mountains. Yep, on foot.

“The Day of the Lord” and “the days of vengeance” are synonymous terms.

For it is the day of the LORD’s vengeance, And the year of recompences for the controversy of Zion.

Isaiah 34:8.

Isaiah’s Day of the Lord is judgment on God’s people which is fulfilled in the Babylonian captivity.

Day of the Lord’s Anger

How hath the Lord covered the daughter of Zion with a cloud in his anger,  And cast down from heaven unto the earth the beauty of Israel, And remembered not his footstool in the day of his anger! The Lord hath swallowed up all the habitations of Jacob, and hath not pitied: He hath thrown down in his wrath the strong holds of the daughter of Judah; He hath brought them down to the ground: he hath polluted the kingdom and the princes thereof. He hath cut off in his fierce anger all the horn of Israel: He hath drawn back his right hand from before the enemy, And he burned against Jacob like a flaming fire, which devoureth round about. He hath bent his bow like an enemy: he stood with his right hand as an adversary, And slew all that were pleasant to the eye In the tabernacle of the daughter of Zion: he poured out his fury like fire.

Lamentations 2:1–4.

The judgment language continues through the rest of the chapter, the final verse calls this judgment, the Day of the Lord’s Anger.

Thou hast called as in a solemn day my terrors round about, So that in the day of the LORD’s anger none escaped nor remained: Those that I have swaddled and brought up hath mine enemy consumed. 

Lamentations 2:22.

Day of Wrath

But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;

Romans 2:5.

Day of Christ

That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

2 Thessalonians 2:2.

Day of God

Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

2 Peter 3:12.

Meaning of Elements

Please note in this verse the word “elements”. Elements in the New Testament is a reference to the Old Testament sacrificial system not the periodic table. Thus, the elements melting away is describing the destruction of the Old Covenant system and its replacement with the New Covenant.

Even so we, when we were children, were in bondage under the elements of the world:

Galatians 4:3.

But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage? Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years. I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.

Galatians 4:9-11.

Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments [elements] of the world, and not after Christ.

Colossians 2:8.

Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments [elements] of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances,

Colossians 2:20.

Only by ripping 2 Peter 3: 10 & 12 out of their context can you try to apply them to the end of the world. Jump back to verses 3 & 4 of this same chapter.

Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts, And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.

2 Peter 3:3–4.

Why were they scoffing? Because Jesus said in Matthew 24 and other places that he would destroy the temple in Jerusalem and not one stone would be left upon another. Jesus also claimed that he would return on the clouds. Jesus claimed that both events would be seen by the generation of those that heard his voice.

After the death and resurrection of Jesus, Herod continued to remodel and upgrade the temple. This remodel was finished in 64 A.D. At the time Peter was writing, the temple in Jerusalem was even more glorious than it was in the days of Jesus.

The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

2 Peter 3: 9

Peter says the Lord was going to keep his word but was giving men time for repentance. This also seems to cross reference nicely with Revelation 6: 11 where the martyrs of Christ were “told to wait a little longer, until the full number of their fellow servants, their brothers and sisters, were killed just as they had been.”

God is waiting for the full number of saints to be converted. Some of these saints were persecuted and lost their lives while others were still coming into the Kingdom. Once this period of time was complete, then his judgment will come.

But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness, Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat? Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

2 Peter 3:10–13.

This section speaks of the land burning up. The Greek word translated earth is not cosmos (or world) but can be translated country as well as earth. Thus, in keeping with Matthew, this can be understood as a local judgment not the end of the planet.

1093.   γῆ gē, ghay; contr. from a primary word; soil; by extension a region, or the solid part or the whole of the terrene globe (incl. the occupants in each application):— country, earth (-ly), ground, land, world.

New Heavens and Earth

Here are other examples of prophetic language for a new heaven and earth.

For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth:  And the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.

Isaiah 65:17.

For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, Shall remain before me, saith the LORD, So shall your seed and your name remain.

Isaiah 66:22.

Getting a “new heavens and a new earth” is a repeated theme in the Old Testament. It never means the planet or life on it is destroyed and replaced. It is always in terms of God remaking things. God makes all things new.

James Jordan, in his Biblical Worldview series on The Garden of God, teaches that there are at least six different creations of heaven and earth taught in the Bible. (Audio for this teaching series is available at Wordmp3.com item PG-475)

Please note that after the new heavens and earth mentioned in Isaiah are established that death remains.     

There shall be no more thence an infant of days, Nor an old man that hath not filled his days: For the child shall die an hundred years old; But the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed.

Isaiah 65:20.

Home construction and agriculture continue.

 And they shall build houses, and inhabit them;  And they shall plant vineyards, and eat the fruit of them.

Isaiah 65:21.

People are still having babies in the new heavens and earth.

They shall not labour in vain, Nor bring forth for trouble; For they are the seed of the blessed of the LORD,  And their offspring with them.

Isaiah 65:23.

Thus, the new heaven and earth in Isaiah are not the end of the world or the end of history.

Lastly, in the passage from Peter, how could his readers in the first century be “Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God” if the Day of the Lord was thousands of years in the future? How could they hasten it? It only makes sense if the Day of the Lord was an event that was near to them and about to happen.

Comments

When people ignore the audience relevance and how the original hearers or readers of the Bible would understand the text addressed to them, then the Bible becomes no better than the ravings of Nostradamus or some lunatic high on PCP. When the Bible is not used to interpret the Bible, then it becomes a device for justifying any doctrine of men or devils. Only by doing violence to the text can you find Artificial Intelligence, thermonuclear weapons, cobra helicopters, barcodes, jogging, gun powder, literal stars falling from the sky to earth, space stations, and such stuff within the pages of Scripture. Once such nonsense is injected into the Bible, it makes Phillip K. Dick’s novels look tame and unimaginative.

God is Active

God speaks.

Man responds.

God evaluates man’s response.

God also blesses and curses. He judges the nations now. They are His. He won them by His death on the cross.

“Ask me, and I will make the nations your inheritance, The ends of the earth you possession.”

Psalm 2:8

He will redeem the earth and reverse the curse. The meek will inherit the earth not heaven. Believers will judge the nations, which is a now thing, not a future one.

In addition to the passages cited above, we also know that Jesus was coming to judge each individual church in Revelation. That’s seven judgements. Clearly there is more judgement in later passages of Revelation. God is always judging. God’s judgment is not a one-off event at the end of history. It is ongoing.

God is active every second of the day in His creation and caring for His creatures.  This side of the Enlightenment, we think the world is governed by laws and scientific principles but that is an illusion. The earth is governed moment by moment by God and His angels. “The laws of nature are the habits of God.” — Augustine

Claims that the “Day of the Lord” only occurs at the end of history have been proven untrue just by my brief survey. Many more examples exist in the Bible. Also, “Day of the Lord” and “Great Day of the Lord” are interchangeable terms. One is not regular judgement and the other denoting the end of the world as the church leader implied when he challenged me about this subject.

What about the Second Coming

The Day of the Lord does not mean the so called Second Coming of Christ at the end of the world. The truth is that Christ comes frequently in time and space. If Christ came a second time following his Ascension, it was to judge Isael in A.D. 70. He predicted exactly that at his trial by the Jewish leaders.

And the high priest answered and said unto him, I adjure thee by the living God, that thou tell us whether thou be the Christ, the Son of God.

Jesus saith unto him, Thou hast said: nevertheless I say unto you, Hereafter shall ye see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.

Then the high priest rent his clothes, saying, He hath spoken blasphemy; what further need have we of witnesses? behold, now ye have heard his blasphemy. What think ye? They answered and said, He is guilty of death.

Matthew 26:63–66.

Note the audience relevance. Those hearing his words would see Jesus coming on the clouds. It would be seen by at least some of the guys that crucified him. The words of Jesus are a quotation from Daniel 7.

I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.

Daniel 7:13–14.

Christ, as ruler of the nations, is constantly judging the nations. He will continue to do so until all enemies are placed under His rule.

Ask of me, And I shall give thee the heathen for thine inheritance, And the uttermost parts of the earth for thy possession.

Psalm 2:8.

The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, Until I make thine enemies thy footstool.

Psalm 110:1.

What About the Last Days

The phrase “last days” is related to the Day of the Lord, at least one of them. The last days of the Old Covenant were the period between the crucifixion of Christ (about 30 A.D.) and the prophesied destruction of the temple in 70 AD.

It is vitally important to emphasize this. Jesus repeatedly predicted the end would be during the lifetime of the generation hearing his words.

Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.

Matthew 16:28.

 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.

Matthew 23:36.

Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

Matthew 24:34.

Verily I say unto you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done.

Mark 13:30.

And when the people were gathered thick together, he began to say, This is an evil generation: they seek a sign; and there shall no sign be given it, but the sign of Jonas the prophet. For as Jonas was a sign unto the Ninevites, so shall also the Son of man be to this generation. The queen of the south shall rise up in the judgment with the men of this generation, and condemn them: for she came from the utmost parts of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and, behold, a greater than Solomon is here. The men of Nineve shall rise up in the judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: for they repented at the preaching of Jonas; and, behold, a greater than Jonas is here.

Luke 11:29–32.

But first must he suffer many things, and be rejected of this generation.

Luke 17:25–18:8.

No stone of the temple would be left upon another, and this generation (those hearing his voice) will not pass away until his words are fulfilled.

And Jesus answering said unto him, Seest thou these great buildings? there shall not be left one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.

Mark 13:2.

The destruction that Jesus warned about was a local judgement. Those heeding the signs could escape on foot if they heeded the signs.

…then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains:

Mark 13:14.

Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:

Matthew 24:16.

Oh, FYI there are zero records that a any Christian died in the siege and destruction of Jerusalem in 70 A.D. Furthermore, this is why believers in Jerusalem were the only group of believers to sell their real estate and hold the proceedings of the sales in common. They knew the mountain of the temple would be cast into the prophetic gentile sea. Jesus promised that too.

Jesus said that the gospel would be preached to the whole Roman Empire (“oikomene” not “kosmos”) and then the end will come and it did.

And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

Matthew 24:14.

If Jesus lied about these prophecies, then he is a false prophet. The irony is if you take Jesus at his word when he promised that this generation (those hearing him speak) would see this judgment, many of his modern followers will call you a heretic or something equivalent.

Why? To believe the text conflicts with their presuppositions. They bring assumptions to the text which are not there and have to recast or ignore any data that conflicts with their interpretive grid.

Scofieldism

Mike Warnke once sang.

“My faith is built on nothing less than Scofield’s notes and Scripture Press.”

Scofield’s grip on American Christianity has had dire consequences for the Church. It has created an escapist mentality that has caused the church to relinquish her transformative power in culture, and influence upon society. Much of the church has lost both its future orientation and its belief in the victory of the Gospel. Instead, evangelical Christians are hiding in the four walls of their church, hoping that the Rapture will rescue them from their failure to transform their culture.

The absolute worst thing derived from Scofield’s eschatology is the notion that when Christians oppose evil, they are preventing the return of Christ. This belief is rooted in the idea that things must get worse and worse. If the world hasn’t gone far enough over the cliff and into hell, then Jesus will never return. Thus, to oppose evil is to keep the world from getting bad enough so Jesus will return. Talk about upside-down land.

Excuse me but the Good Book says judgment begins at the house of the Lord. Well, actually it began in the house of the Lord long ago, but somehow the sheep think being under judgment is normal. The water has been boiling for a while, but the frogs are happy as long as the sunscreen doesn’t run out.

Two quick examples: the abortion rate among Christians and Non-Christians is statistically identical and has been for decades. Ditto for divorce rate.

If the church is doing so great, why does it look so much like the world?

Last Thoughts

I was at the church’s Monday Night Men’s Bible Study this week. They are very slowly going through a prayer that Jesus offered for his disciples. The passage is in the Gospel of John, chapter 17. Verse 15 survived without much comment, so I’d like to take it up.

“My prayer is not that you take them out of the world but that you protect them from the evil one.”

What? Jesus is praying that God not Rapture Christians! Oh, clearly Jesus is mistaken.

All I hear about is Jesus is coming any second. Any time Rapture. 1948 happened so it’ll be any time now. Hal Lindsey sold 25 million copies of his book claiming a generation is forty years. Then he went for 50 years. Oops, then 60 years. Then Hal died. Subsequently, OK, maybe 80 years. Alex, can I have a lifeline for 100 years. 

It’s the same refrain that I’ve heard since the 1970’s. Folks, it’s not true. Sorry kids, it’s not happening. The church has thousands of years’ worth of work yet to do.

I believe the Day of the Lord happens frequently. It is a fearful thing. God judges the nations all the time. Sometimes it’s even dramatic enough that we give him the credit for acting. Berlin Wall, anyone?

Also, there is no Rapture in the Bible. The only ones taken away in the Old or New Testament are evil doers. The righteous remain.

Noah and the Ark. We always read “…so as in the days of Noah …”

Please actually read the darn text, the bad guys are taken away, but the righteous remain. Check it out.

For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

Matthew 24:38–39.

Keep reading in Matthew, two at the mill and one taken in judgment not to heaven.

Again, the meek will inherit the earth, not heaven. This is a promise for believers in this life, not one yet to come.

I look forward to the day when the knowledge of the Lord covers the earth as the waters cover the sea.

For the earth shall be filled with the knowledge of the glory of the LORD, As the waters cover the sea. 

Habakkuk 2:14.

They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain: For the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the LORD, As the waters cover the sea.

Isaiah 11:9.

Many more Days of the Lord remain before this promise will be a reality.